Hi Tiffany, you're always very down to earth on your replies and I wanted to ask you this. A post just crossed my dash saying how CS is supportive of rape culture because Emma said no to him for two seasons and that he forced her to accept him, and that the whole "when I win your heart" line was problematic and wrong, and it has 1k+ notes. Are we maybe ignoring a problematic nature within our ship? Are any of those claims valid? It makes me feel bad for not seeing any of that (1/2)
(2/2) or not finding it problematic when I may be blinded with shipper goggles. Also it makes me sad that so many people apparently find the ship so triggering and if that’s the case, again maybe there are problematic aspects to it and I’m just ignoring them because I love the ship? I am really interested on your opinion because I come to Tumblr to escape stress and all of this kind of just depress me that I may not be allowed to enjoy my OTP because it sends a negative msg
Answered this here. As a rape survivor myself, it actually infuriates me to watch fandom try to use my experience as a defense for hating on something that’s completely irrelevant. As I discussed with Tricia earlier: if anyone has been sexually predatory in this ship, it’s Emma (she’s the one who got Hook BLACKOUT DRUNK and lured him down into his cabin), but that’s not what haters would have you believe. They call Hook a rapist because his personality reminds them of people who, in real life, may or may not display sexually predatory traits. Hook himself does not. End of story.
Emma has never, eVER said “no” to Hook. She told him “now’s not the time” in Neverland, then promptly turned around and kissed him. She told him “I don’t want to deal with romance when I just want to find my son” and he completely backed off, allowing her to make the moves from that point forward. And before I get anyone saying “consent isn’t presence of a no it’s the absence of yes!!” let’s just point out that when Emma WAS confronted with Hook’s feelings in 3.11, she said “good.” That is a “yes, please continue.” That is affirmation that she welcomes his feelings.
Hook allows Emma to come to him at his own pace. People are fucking gross to call that rape culture and it’s physically sickening to me to watch something I HAVE EXPERIENCED be twisted into a petty excuse to hate something fandom-related. It’s enormously toxic to call something like CS rape culture because it perpetuates the idea that “rape culture” is something trivial, not a big deal, etc. because there’s nothing wrong with the behavior either of them has displayed towards the other. Rape culture is a series of normalized behaviors that eventually lead to placing the blame of rape on women — there is no sexual assault present here, nor any “red light behaviors” that would be considered warning lines or pushing that boundary.
If people find it triggering, that’s their business. I won’t tell them what to be triggered by — many people are triggered by otherwise harmless images and actions just because it’s connected to their own personal experience. Cigarette smoke can be a trigger, that doesn’t make cigarette smoke inherently problematic.
I think you need to unfollow whoever the hell is stupid enough to be associating CS with rape that you have on your dash tbh.
Agree with this so much. As a victim of sexual assault and someone who has been emotionally manipulated by guys before, I would never ship anyone I felt crossed those lines even the least bit. “Emotional manipulation” isn’t just about rape per se, but falls in the category of what Hook gets blamed for. (In my case, I’ve had guys tell me how good they are for me, what they have done, and also that I have too many issues to ever find anyone else who would deal with me, that I would never find anyone else who loves me, etc, etc.) Emotional manipulation could be sexual or more general than that, but I hear such accusations thrown at Hook. From what was shown on screen, none of it applies to Hook.
In matter of fact, one of the reasons I like Captain Swan and what I admire about Hook is the fact that, despite having a flirtatious side, he hasn’t crossed any physical boundaries with Emma or emotionally pushed her into having a relationship with him. His only “crime” is just being there - supporting Emma, helping Emma, and being there however she needs or wants him to be. And that isn’t a crime at all.
Physically, he has always allowed Emma to make the first move. Emma first “hugged” him on the bean stalk, she touched his mouth by giving him CPR, and she initiated both kisses (NL and SB). Hook has rarely even touched her without her first touching him or by him asking if he could touch her (“give me your hand”) - a few exceptions in 3.21-22, but none of his touches were unwelcome. The only real exception would the the failed TL kiss in NYC (a poor plan to get her memories back, but no different than Charming), and we know what happened to him. It isn’t the fact that Emma can and will defend herself that makes Hook “ok.” It’s that - other than the failed TLK - he hasn’t ever crossed her boundaries. If he did, we would know via a strong negative reaction from Emma. However, he hasn’t pushed her sexually or physically. That isn’t the type of person he has ever been portrayed to be.
He has also never pushed her emotionally — not in attempt to get her to be in a relationship with him nor anything else. I super admire him for not using guilt to try and get her to have a relationship with him. Maybe it is just the guys I know, but I’m near certain the guys I know who were interested me would tell me instantly if they gave up a ship for me. Hook, however, only did when he asked.
In general, Hook had plenty of opportunities to tell Emma what he did for her, or even how much he loves her or how good he is for her…. but he never said any of that. He laid out his intentions “I will win your heart without trickery” and he has stuck by that. The power and pace of the relationship has been in Emma’s hands. All of season 3, he has been there but has never even said that she ought to be in a relationship with him.
Also, Emma hasn’t ever said “no” or implied she wanted him to stop anything. For it to be rape or a pre-rape conditioning, she would have to be saying no to sex or other advances, which he has never propositioned her or pushed for, implied or otherwise. But for the closest purpose we have, she has never said no to him being around or implied that she didn’t like him around. Actually, in 3.19, she was waiting for him for their meeting; clearly she asked him to be there and that probably wasn’t the first time she asked him (he was always at their meetings in season 3B, and somehow I doubt it was Snowing or Regina who were informing him when to show up). Emma asked Hook to join them at dinner and on and on. Clearly, Emma wants him around, and he doesn’t make her uncomfortable.
To be honest, when I hear Hook accused of “rape culture,” it makes me discouraged to think that some people might actually believe that being there, supporting someone… is wrong. Even being around someone who doesn’t return your feelings isn’t rape — not in of itself. If a guy is just being there - not pushing physical boundaries and not pushing emotional ones - but just being there to help…. that’s not rape.
Worse than any of that, is that this outlook trivializes what rape and rape culture really is.